1991 Maxx Update Racing Forum

The 1991 Maxx Update is currently listed as a Box Set on its own.  My question is should this be listed as variations/corrections within the main 1991 Maxx Set?  I know these cards are commonly found in their own factory box set, but that was not the only way they were distributed. I know for sure that factory sets were issued with either the original printing or with the Update cards in place of (not in addition to) the cards from the first printing.  These factory sets are easy to tell, as the Elliott card in the front display of the packaging has a different photo.

Here is an example of one with the early printing- * 1991 MAXX Race Cards Nascar set Box - NEW condition vintage Factory Sealed | eBay

Here is one with the update printing- 1991 MAXX Race Cards Complete 240 NASCAR Card Set FACTORY SEALED BOX | eBay

I haven't opened packs of these in a long time, but I thought I remember later printing packs having the Update cards in them, and I don't think the packs were obviously different in appearance from the earlier printing.  Maybe someone else out there has a better memory of this than me.  

Even if they weren't packed out, with different printings of the factory sets including the update cards, shouldn't these fall under the main set as either Corrections or Variations?

Interested to hear other's thoughts on this.

Poking around on Ebay, it does look like they differentiated the packs with the update cards.  In this auction, it says "Printing II" above the NASCAR logo on the top of the box- MAXX 1991 NASCAR RACE CARDS ~ FACTORY SEALED ~ BOX WITH 36 PACKS | eBay

Here is the earlier printing- 1991 MAXX Race Cards Nascar Wax Pack Box - 36 Packs Factory Sealed | eBay

I may be confusing sets (only because we'vve handled so many), but I'm almost certain this set was being handled in with the flagship set, and we were convinced by some members (plural) that it should only be listed as a standalone factory set. (Again, maybe it was another set, but I know we did that with a NASCAR update set.)

I believe that the way we have them listed here is more accurate than adding the Update cards as VAR or COR cards in the main set. All of the info about the Update cards is listed with the main set, so anyone looking for their specific card can easily tell if their card doesn't match the one in the base set. Due to the popularity of this set when it was released, Maxx made a 2nd printing AFTER the Update set was released so that those who wanted a factory set with the corrected cards (and updated photos for some drivers) could get them.

Technically, the "Update" cards are all VARs or CORs, but since they were released as a solo set first, I think our listings are correct as they are now. The packaging for 2nd printing clearly states that they are the 2nd printing, but the cards do not. If someone gets a boxed Update set, they may be confused on how to find it if nothing shows up in a search for 1991 Maxx Update. The sealed Update sets are still out there and I know that for a fact since I have a couple dozen of them.

If anything needs to change, I would suggest adding a NOTE to both sets that Update cards could be found in "Printing II" packs and factory sets.

What Adam says is spot on. A Release Notes update is all that needs to be done.

So the facts on these are:

1.) Update cards were released as a box set and is the most common way to find them (may have been the only way to find them at some point back in 1991)

2.) Maxx did a second print run of packs and included the update cards in those packs.  Maxx did call out the second print run on the box and packs (see pack image here- 2 Packs New Sealed Vintage 1991 Maxx NASCAR 30 Racing Race Cards Printing II 36037910166 | eBay  )  Print II does seem more difficult to find compared to the first printing, but there are multiple auctions on ebay for packs/boxes (although not always called out in the auction title, many times you have to look at the picture to figure out which it is)

3.)  Maxx did a second print run of factory sets and included the update cards in those sets.  Again, these appear to be more difficult to find on ebay, but there are still multiple auctions of this going on right now.  Like the boxes, most of these auctions don't differentiate from the first print run in the listing.

If #1 was the only way the cards were distributed, then I agree with you.  However, #2 and #3 happened and by the rules laid out for the site, it seems these should be included with the main set.  Obviously packaging would move over there, along with some notes about distribution.  

I know that will be a pain to do, and I also know that Admin does make some exceptions to the rules.  Is it worth reaching out to Admin to get his opinion on this?  If we are making an exception to the rules, it seems like it should only be with his permission, unless I am misinterpreting something.

Seems like the "Second Printing" was more of a "repack" job than anything else.

If the factory Update sets were available well before any Second Printing "wax" was available, then notes shoulkd be added about re-packs done by the company.

If the Second Printing "wax" was available simultaneouslty with the factory Update sets, then we may have some shifting around to do.

May require some research to know for sure.  Anyone have any of the old Maxx Faxx newsletters from that period?  Here is a page from one I found with a checklist, but no notes on distribution on that page- https://i0.wp.com/www.racingcardinfo.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/MFPart2A-scaled.jpg?w=1250

Looks like that is from December 1991.  If they were just releasing a checklist then, seems like not a lot of time until the 1992 cards would have been issued.

This set predates my collecting experience by almost a decade, so I don't have any firsthand knowledge of the distribution.  I do have several period hobby publications to refer to, though.

I'll start with the 800-lb gorilla.  My copy of the Beckett Annual is #5 from early-2000 (but from what I can tell Beckett writes their copy when the sets are new and then never edits it).  The description of the base set describes two factory sets, the regular with the 240-card base set, and a "Deluxe" that includes the base set plus the Acrylics and the Updates.  The blurb for the Update set reads; "This 48-card set was distributed in 1991 Maxx "Deluxe" mail order sets and in foil packs from the second printing.  It was also made available for purchase individually through Maxx's mail order division....", and it goes on to talk about the checklist.  The 1991 Maxx and 1991 Maxx Update sets are listed in separate checklists.

The Speedway Limited Edition price guide (ca. 1992) lists the Update set in a separate checklist than the base set, but doesn't speak to the distribution of either.

In Collector's World Racing Magazine, Vol1 No1 (May 1991), it is noted of the 1991 Maxx 240-card set that "At this time, we are aware of several errors.  But Maxx has not stated if they will be corrected."  The 1991 Maxx Update checklist first appears in issue #7 (November 1991).  It is listed as its own set, but no mention is made of the distribution.  For Vol2 No1 (May 1992) they stopped publishing the complete checklist in each issue, but continued to price the Update set separate from the base set.  By the July 1992 issue, they listed separate pricing for five 1991 Maxx sets:

1st Print Set (Factory)
1st Print Set (Hand Collated)
2nd Print Set (Factory)
2nd Print Set (Hand Collated)
Update (48 Corrected Cards)

That is all of the reference material that I have at hand.  Following is the opinion portion portion of this post.

Clarity is key.  Normally I advocate for following 'da rules' when listing sets in the database because consistency in the information formatting keeps things clear.  There are some cases like this one, though, where I think we should defer to the convention of the hobby at large.  The 1991 Maxx Update cards have been catalogued as their own set for 30+ years.  I think it would cause more confusion, particularly among people coming to TCDB for the first time, to now eliminate the Update set and just call the cards variations.  People are going to come to TCDB looking for the 1991 Maxx Update set.  Not having the cards listed that way will cause more confusion than following database conventions will solve.  That said, I'm on the fence about whether I think it should stay listed as a Boxed Set or be moved to the 'Related' section under the main 1991 Maxx listing.

-Tom

If you look at the Change Log on the Update set AND the main set back in late 2018, you will see all the extensive work I did to make the sets comply with each other and confirm that all info was correct. This was after getting a massive collection that included tons of the cards in all formats except the 2nd printing cards. I also got several of the 1991 Maxx Faxx books that confirmed the 2nd printing was well after the Update boxes. The "deluxe" set includes everything that was made before it. I did extensive research in 2018 to make sure that everything about the 1991 Maxx products were listed correctly and could easily be found with cross-reference whenever there could be confusion from the packs of 2nd Printing of the cards.

I would say that I don't have a problem moving Update to "Related" but it is neither a mail-in set nor a promo, proof, etc. The cards were released mainstream as a boxed set to buy in card shops. They were originally packaged as a set of 48 cards in a sealed box like a deck of cards which were distributed in 12 "pack" hobby boxes. I have all the proof of what I'm saying about these. It's all already in the listings and packaging for both sets.