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cnangle
Posts: 1,127
Joined: Nov 2011
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 11:46 AM | |
In 1891 W. Duke, Sons & Company, Allen & Ginter, W.S. Kimball & Co., Kinney Tobacco, and Goodwin & Co. merged to form the American Tobacco Company (ATC).
Each of them continued to produce cards to insert into their respective tobacco products. The series produced by each sub-division of the ATC are generally named with the sub-division name. For example "1891 Allen & Ginter Prize & Game Chickens".
My question: on the set details page should we enter "Allen & Ginter" or "American Tobacco Company" in the "Brand" Field?
I personally like to be able to search by "Allen & Ginter" because that is the main thing you see on the back. Plus A&G are my favorite. Here's a sample card so you can see how both "Allen & Ginter" and "American Tobacco Company" are displayed.
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My two-cents is worth slightly more than a penny. -- Chad --
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RoundtheDiamond87
Posts: 808
Joined: Oct 2015
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 11:50 AM | |
Good question. I'd probably still be calling them Allen & Ginter until the name disappeared. If you had to use both names, I'd go hierarchically from more general to more specific (i.e. 2017 - Topps - Allen & Ginter - Mini - Black Border). In your case, replace Topps with American Tobacco Co.
Edited on: Feb 8, 2018 - 12:37PM
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C2Cigars
Posts: 11,470
Joined: Oct 2014
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 12:05 PM | |
I would use the name as listed in the American Card Catalog (ACC).
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Someday my cards may double in value and then be worth half of what I paid for them.
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RoundtheDiamond87
Posts: 808
Joined: Oct 2015
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 12:15 PM | |
The now defunct ACC makes for a good secondary naming convention like 1933 Goudey (R319), 1915 Crackerjack (E145-2), etc.
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Billy Kingsley
Posts: 7,512
Joined: Aug 2011
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 12:47 PM | |
Allen & Ginter. Match the cards. ATC is not printed on them for the most part...although I'm sure it appears on some at some point.
Look at Topps and O-Pee-Chee. Mostly the same cards for a long time, but both at one time or another produced cards for the other. We don't list them as Topps O-Pee-Chee or O-Pee-Chee Topps, even though like I say, they made the cards for the other at various times.
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VERY slow trading due to health problems. Not transferrable so safe to trade with, just moving is painful and can't always access the cards. Cardboard History My COMC New Collection Website: Cardboard History Gallery (Still under construction) Tips on how to make your scans look like the card does in hand (No more washed out, fuzzy scans!):
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RoundtheDiamond87
Posts: 808
Joined: Oct 2015
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 1:06 PM | |
I don't know all the specifics with O-Pee-Chee, but I thought it was basically the Canadian name for Topps meant to be used in place of, and not in conjunction with, the other.
This example may be a little different. ATC purchased all of the card companies, and then slowly phased out their names over time, but used both names for a little while longer.
Edited on: Feb 8, 2018 - 1:14PM
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C2Cigars
Posts: 11,470
Joined: Oct 2014
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 1:08 PM | |
"American Tobacco Company" is printed right on the bottom of the card back. ATC had 20+ brands they put cards in.
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Someday my cards may double in value and then be worth half of what I paid for them.
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Billy Kingsley
Posts: 7,512
Joined: Aug 2011
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 6:14 PM | |
In that case, I would say it could probably go either way. Brands that have been bought out are generally listed here using the brand name, not the producer's name, so the argument could be made either way. (See: Any Bowman brand product after Topps bought them out). I personally would not list them as ATC, I would just call them Allen & Ginter or whatever brand it happened to be, but does anyone really care what I have to say? It's not like I was alive during that time frame and have first hand experience after all.
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VERY slow trading due to health problems. Not transferrable so safe to trade with, just moving is painful and can't always access the cards. Cardboard History My COMC New Collection Website: Cardboard History Gallery (Still under construction) Tips on how to make your scans look like the card does in hand (No more washed out, fuzzy scans!):
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cnangle
Posts: 1,127
Joined: Nov 2011
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 6:22 PM | |
I care what you have to say. Especially when you agree with me. I like Allen & Ginter too.
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My two-cents is worth slightly more than a penny. -- Chad --
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C2Cigars
Posts: 11,470
Joined: Oct 2014
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Thursday, February 8, 2018 6:39 PM | |
PSA uses "1891 Allen & Ginter Prize and Game Chickens (N20)" and they usually use the ACC set name.
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Someday my cards may double in value and then be worth half of what I paid for them.
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